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I hope the fella with the neck tattoos is better than the last one, Jack King.

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How many clubs will be expecting to finish above us?

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Siderite wrote:

Personally, I find that quite a narrow minded article based on stereotypes that do nothing but shore up an opinion that a manager, who despite being so good to guide crap England to semis and finals, wouldn’t be touched by top clubs or the nations with prestigious histories in tournaments. If France don’t succeed they wouldn’t touch Gareth with a barge pole, even if they get over the nationality issue.

I think it’s a clearly provocative article but it’s intention is, to my mind, to get people to think about WHY they have such high expectations of this group of players and how they view a manager who has been the most successful for England in the last 60 years.

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This sums up my thoughts perhaps better than I have done on this thread:

https://www.football365.com/news/southgate-klopp-england-exactly-the-same-john-nicholson

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It just feels like a film we’ve seen for decades – over-hyped “great” players who are apparently wonderful but who lack the technical ability to shine in an England shirt – hence why England players can’t keep the ball and end up giving it away cheaply in games. And yesterday was a real prime example of it. Rice was awful in possession, looked like someone pulled out of the stands to play, then there’s the fact that there are apparently only 2 English left-backs in the top flight, both of whom are injured. The goalkeeper doesn’t fill me with confidence either but where’s the competition there?

We can blame the manager all we like, and we clearly won’t be in the job after the end of the tournament, whenever that comes, but unless the game addresses the reasons behind the slim pickings in key areas (GK, LB, CB, CM) then I don’t see how things can improve massively. It’s all very well complaining that Grealish or that boy from Chelsea or whoever haven’t been picked but the issues run much deeper than that.

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MK Iron wrote:

Can we have someone come on and tell me Southgate is doing a good job?

While you’re at it convince me why I am being unrealistic to expect we could do better than snatch a lucky draw against a team of reasonable Championship standard?

I’d point at Southgate’s record of semis & a final as being in the “credit” side of the ledger.

Yesterday wasn’t great and he has questions to answer but equally most of the players in that team couldn’t make a simple pass. Saka’s final ball was atrocious, I don’t think he found a teammate with a single cross. Foden looked better but shot wildly over when through on goal. Kane can’t/won’t move. These things can’t really be laid at the manager’s door and just shows how massively over-rated a lot of England’s players are.

Also, don’t most of Denmark’s team play in the Premier League too?

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Peter Promise wrote:

Are you still allowed to park on Gunness straight?If not where can you park to get a prompt exit to Gunness or the M181 please?

You could last season as long as you’re fully off the road, which isn’t easy as there are potholes so deep you could hide in them.

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I can see parallels between Grealish and McManaman – both exciting youngsters who could beat a man and “make things happen” but who both had that coached out of them at big clubs, their trophy-winning success coming at the price of their individual flair.

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I have a theory that there has never been a good Puma shirt and their efforts at this tournament haven’t changed my mind.

The Adidas stripes suit the Italian shirt quite well, I reckon.

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Just Iron wrote:

Agreed. Grealish has more competition than Shaw ..and I definitely think a fit Grealish would be a great option for any team at the Euros. I don’t know so much about his off field stuff but probably don’t think it’s affected his selection. Could be wrong but I think it’s down to lack of game time at City plus all our ‘riches’ being midfield and attack.

Has Grealish ever done anything in an England shirt? I can’t recall much. He has been neutered as a player at Citeh, he just dribbles slowly forwards and then passes it 5 yards sideways.

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Never impressed me in an Iron shirt and the fact he’s dropped down a league, presumably for the cash, says plenty.

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Deereyme66 wrote:

That’s ridiculous in my opinion. He won’t be and they do. I don’t think England players are over rated either. Not justified.

I think there is already an over-the-top level of criticism in the press and among England fans about last night’s performance. It was a good win against the best team in the group that virtually guarantees qualification, in a formation that gets the most out of the team’s best player. Lots to be positive about.

Siderite wrote:

That is on Southgate and I feel like he cannot get more out of the squad, so if we fail, I would like to see a fresh start with another manager who can maybe identify how to maximise the potential.

I think that this is typical of how England fans have a warped view of their team. What does “fail” mean? Because I reckon a lot of people think it translates as “don’t win the cup”. Similarly, maximising the potential of individuals is not the same as maximising the potential of the team. Just because there are a bunch of attacking midfielders available, that doesn’t make a team. He’s got no left backs and virtually no fit and/or experienced centre backs. The goalkeeper’s pretty ropey too. All that has to be balanced against attacking sacrifices.

Siderite wrote:

It doesn’t seem fair to make out that we have achieved more results under Southgate because of him alone and to say failures only come because of players alone, or vice versa

That’s fair but too often I think the opposite is true – the manager gets all the blame, the players get all the credit.

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Deereyme66 wrote:

Yes, he is too defensive. Too often the team drifts into sitting back and deep after going ahead, unecessarily inviting pressure. I wouldn’t say England are no good, but IMO they are not fulfilling their potential in the slightest and the tactical nous looks bereft. Against a better side last night they’d have lost 2-1. I have no confidence in them dealing with the tournaments best. Really screwed if they go behind too. Just my opinion

Average of 2 goals a game, nearly half of which are in knock-out ties. 10 clean sheets in tournament matches.

England have never been any good apart from one summer in the late 1960s. England have no God-given right to do well in tournaments. England’s fans and press hounded a reasonably successful manager in Erikssen because of his apparent “defensiveness” because England did win well enough. England were absolutely terrible between Erikssen and Southgate.

England’s players are consistently over-rated, just because the Premier League is incredibly wealthy, and are consistently shown up by other country’s players in major tournaments.

Southgate has been by some distance the most successful England manager for my 40+ years on the planet but he’ll be vilified by the fans & press because England fans simply don’t know how to be happy.

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1-0
1-2
3-0
3-0
0-0
6-2
1-1
2-1
4-0
2-0
1-0
0-0
1-0
1-2
2-0
1-1
0-1
6-1
2-1

Southgate’s major tournament record: 19 games, 37 goals scored, 12 conceded, only 2 games lost in normal time. But yes, Southgate is too defensive and England are no good.

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Agree on Cleveland, one of Scunny’s most under-rated players. His contribution to the 2006/07 title was equal to that of Keogh, Sharp, Crosby, Foster, Murphy, etc.

I remember when Steve MacLean scored that goal at Hull, Cleveland pogo-d past the away end behind the goal, celebrating wildly. A proper Iron great.

1 user thanked author for this post.

Just Iron

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WonderGoals wrote:

Fresh selection of Beverages including Birra Moretti, Cruzcampo and Inch’s Cider. Investment from Heineken as part of the deal means we will get new upgraded equipment in the cellar and bar areas for pouring and dispensing. That’s been needed for a long, long time.

Looks like the push to make the club better is also extending now to the catering operation. Good to see.

Is that for the Iron Bar WG? Or the bar under the Clugston stand?

Until there is some investment in the equipment in the catering areas, and in the staffing there, you can’t expect to see great improvements. If only we had been owned by someone who had a track record in the hospitality industry who could have used some of that “expertise” to make improvements.

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TheJuryeffsOut wrote:

Hopefully they recreate that goal at Iron aid if only to stick 2 fingers at Swann who threw Morris under the bus, in my opinion.

One of the very few times I’ve ever agreed with Peter Swann. One of the lowest points in the Iron’s history, on the pitch.

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WonderGoals wrote:

I read on twitter from Matt that she quit and so Michael Abey on the 6th of June. Elliot resigned on the 10th of June. Not sure what’s happened, but something must have kicked off.

Or she’s a busy business woman and has other commitments now that the dust is settling at SUFC?

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Awaywego wrote:

Now wanting money back from Hilton!
Let’s say he raked in £50.000 a game for the 14 league games in charge £700.000
1300 season tickets say £400.000
The 1899 club or 100 club as it turned out another £200.000 there.
That’s 1.3 million he took in.
Yet paid the tax bill to get us out of the embargo £250.000 we’ll say.
We’ll say 8 months wages February to and including September £150.000 a month say, so that’ll be £1.2 million plus the £250.000tax bill making £1,450.000 he paid out taking for granted he never paid any other bill.
My figures are more than generous for what he raked in. So what money do we want back from Hilton.

Bless, you must be the only person who still believes he paid for anything.

3 users thanked author for this post.

Awaywego, TheJuryeffsOut, Deereyme66

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64 wrote:

Subsidising millionaires,suckers!

Who are the millionaires?

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Northumbiron wrote:

An evening in Hartlepool on our 42nd wedding anniversary!

She shouldn’t be surprised by now!

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Sorry if my question came across as a bit sharp Cass, I was just curious if you’d heard or read anything along those lines.

1 user thanked author for this post.

cassidystash

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cassidystash wrote:

Is it possible that some of those players were signed for (not by) Dean? Can’t believe he wanted Youmbi.

What makes you think that? The fact he barely played him, or something else?

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I get the impression from listening to Michelle’s interviews that she felt let down by backing Dean in the transfer market only to see him sign a bunch of players he never used.

1 user thanked author for this post.

ironfromafar

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£1.7 million wage bill last season really stood out in that interview. Anyone saying that “Butterfield was disrespected” needs to stare at that number until they can join up the dots.

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cassidystash wrote:

Increased bench means a keeper required. We’ll probably have to sign one because who is going to loan us a player who has little to no chance of game time?

Slightly disagree there – just because we *can* name more subs, doesn’t mean we *have* to. Carrying a full-time reserve keeper might be a luxury we can’t afford, instead relying on emergency loans if anything happens to Fitzsimons.

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ironfromafar wrote:

I presume Michelle has split the ownership up to not only recoup some of her funds but also to spread the decision making.

Slightly the opposite I think – she said on the Iron Bru podcast that other people had put money in during the takeover and they would convert that into equity (shares), which is what has happened now. So it is essentially another step along the road of sorting out the club from last October.

2 users thanked author for this post.

Just Iron, Sanfran49

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Deereyme66 wrote:

Wonder what their definition of ‘some sort of sustainability’ is? Be a shame if it’s hollow words and they’re left with a huge unsustainable budget if and when the big spenders leave.

I’ll credit them with improving the ground, that’s a tangible benefit. And the £9 million owed to one of the actors may be written off, which helps the club. But even though their latest accounts show impressive increases in turnover, they still lost nearly as much money as their wage bill, which is not my definition of “sustainable”.

1 user thanked author for this post.

Deereyme66

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Apollo11 wrote:

It’s notable that Dean has had absolutely nothing to say since leaving Scunthorpe United – at the least you’d have thought he’d be offering a word to the fans.

I assume he’s been snapped-up by an ambitious club given the excellent job he was doing here, and his impressive coaching CV?

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Apollo11 wrote:

One of the things that is clear in the programme is that they work within a budget (big as it may be) and are trying to work towards some sort of sustainability.

I mean they can say whatever they like in a show which they seem to curate but it doesn’t alter that they (and Stockport) have been financially doping for the last couple of seasons, completely distorting fair competition in their leagues, and buying their way to success.

I appreciate they have had much bigger crowds for the last couple of years since the actors came in but they still lost over £5 million in their most recent accounts. £5m in the Conference! Jesus wept. Makes our recent owners look like penny-pinchers. Those accounts show a player wage bill of £6 million. They owed nearly £9m to one of the actor-owners. Incredible numbers.

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