Taking to the knee.

[Yossarian Lives]

i wish you would end mr snore

[Iron-awe]

…weigh you down.

[WonderGoals]

Iron-awe wrote:

Northumbiron wrote:

“Trained Marxist”?

Lenin en-route from Switzerland to Russia?

They don’t half come up with some daft stuff!

Aye and let’s not forget this stuff has come from You Tube, I mean everybody knows everything posted on You Tube is true, right?

She said those exact words in an interview, go look it up. Trust me, you’ll find that it’s as real as it gets.

[Deereyme66]

The players, the FA, the Prime Minister, and the majority of supporters are asking the so called supporters that intend to boo today, not to. Are a minority still going to disgrace themselves and some posters on here still going to defend them? Show some respect. The Denmark and Finland fans in Copenhagen showed you how to behave.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/boris-johnson-england-fans-boo-knee-b1864726.html

[Yossarian Lives]

there goes the Deirdre morality lesson

[billpuntonsghost]

Show some respect and accept you have no freedom to protest anymore.

[Deereyme66]

Nonsensical. Are you against what the Prime Minister is saying? Are you a traitor?

[Deereyme66]

The players are making a stand. The so called supporters booing are the ones protesting. I wouldn’t expect a person of your intelligence, with the twisted logic you use and fairytales you repeat, to understand that.

[Gurnelista]

WG, many movements have a lot of different views within them. Presumably your wife/girlfriend/daughter/mother expects equal pay, and equality in law with men. But, that doesn’t make her an extreme feminist who wants to remove men from the face of the earth, for example (these types do exist!).

Back in the 60s and 70s when women were marching for more equality in law and equal pay with men, there were many on both sides would have said they were extreme, mad, and bad.

They said they were ‘burning their bras’, that they wanted to be fellas, and even that they were Marxists. Especially in the popular press, in the working men’s clubs, in tv sitcoms…. they were all ready to poke fun, talk about the danger to society as we know it, how it was all part of a slippery slope and so on.

But who now would expect their wife/girlfriend/daughter/mother to do the same job for less money, or be discriminated against in law?

WG, it’s the same with BLM. Seek out extremists and you’ll find some, which is exactly what the far right is doing in order to frighten people.

But that doesn’t mean that those who support ‘the knee’ and want to see an end to discrimination and respect for black people are all raving Marxists, any more than your own wife/girlfriend/mother/daughter was an extreme feminist.

They just want decency, respect and an end to discrimination. And so should we all.

1 user thanked author for this post.

Ex Officio

[billpuntonsghost]

“ Nonsensical.Are you against what the Prime Minister is saying?”
Yes.
“The so called supporters booing are the ones protesting.”
True.
Freedom is something we should cherish.
Is every team in Euro 21 taking the knee.
No.
Surely the “majority”of England fans should boo when watching their games in protest .
Am I a traitor?
No.

[Deereyme66]

‘Freedom is something we should cherish.
Is every team in Euro 21 taking the knee.
No.
Surely the “majority”of England fans should boo when watching their games in protest’.

Like I said, twisted logic. You don’t think people should have the right to protest you said above (actually you don’t think they have that right now which is even more bizarre). You support people booing people making a peaceful gesture about racial discrimination. This is sounding very similar to fascism and the behaviour of the black shirts. Perhaps you think they were right too?

[Deereyme66]

Actually, you don’t know your a*** from your elbow. One minute you’re saying people haven’t got the right to protest, the next you are. Like I said, fascism. In your world people are only allowed to protest if you agree with the cause. You couldn’t make it up.

[Northumbiron]

You can’t “train” someone to be a Marxist anymore than you can train someone to be a Capitalist.

You present them with the core values and they make their own minds up.

How many times must footballers have to repeat that they not making a far left political gesture, but a humanitarian one?

The thing that, in my opinion, confuses matters is the difference between “thee knee” in Europe and the USA.

American footballer Colin Kaepernick originally made the gesture during the playing of the National Anthem. In other words kneeling when others were standing. Doing the opposite in protest.

In many ways this doesn’t work here because players don’t stand for the National Anthem in league games. If it was done during the anthems preceding an International match that would be wholly inappropriate.

It is not a protest against a whole nation (as Kaepernick intended) but against far-right groups and individuals who continue to promote white supremacy and racial hatred.

Perhaps this has clouded some people’s judgment.

Certain individuals like Wilf Zaha choose not to do it as they think it’s demeaning. They may have a point, as kneeling is a gesture of servitude. But it is free choice, and at the moment the England team are united in continuing with the gesture.

Until someone comes up with something else it’s the best we’ve got!

I’ll continue to support it.

[Deereyme66]

‘Is every team in Euro 21 taking the knee.
No.’

No one is going to boo them for not doing it. They’re free to do as they wish. Absolutely pointless.

[Deereyme66]

And I wouldn’t dictate that the booers stop. I’m saying I think they shouldn’t boo. I think they’re wrong.

[billpuntonsghost]

A lot of the main posters on this site are Marxists unfortunately.
Look at the last Century at the misery Marxism has created.
120 millions deaths ,untold hardship,famine,freedom destroyed,but the main posters on this site are full on with Critical theory,neo Marxism that will lead to more misery and freedoms destroyed.The abandonment of a Christian worldview will be catastrophic for the whole world.

[Northumbiron]

In your opinion!

We’ll quickly skip over the countless millions killed in the name of religion shall we?

[Deereyme66]

‘A lot of the main posters on this site are Marxists unfortunately.’

Utter twaddle.

[Iron-awe]

billpuntonsghost wrote:

A lot of the main posters on this site are Marxists unfortunately.

Evidence? You always resort to this drivel bill when pushed into a corner on your views, maybe it’s time you came up with something better or perhaps do some serious thinking about other people’s point of view. Stop hiding behind labels and slogans man, it’s pathetic.

[billpuntonsghost]

Let’s compare the countries of the world who have lived under a totalitarian regime/ Marxism in the last Century and countries with a Christian “worldview”. Which countries have prospered the most.My last post was pointing to the misery about to unfold due to the adandonment of a Christian “worldview.”

[MK Iron]

Racial equality and indeed any other equality has nothing to do with Marxism.

Anyone trying to suggest that England’s footballers or regular posters on this site are Marxists is trying to justify their own extremist viewpoint.

Could we either get this thread back on topic or move it to the extremist/crazy people board?

[MK Iron]

Or could Mr Swann sign a few players and give us all something relevant to argue about?

[billpuntonsghost]

Iron awe – evidence?
If you read my posts you would say “Christian”.
If you read the main posters on here you would say “Marxists.”

[Deereyme66]

No. When you read them BPG, you say Marxists. Why can’t you stay on topic instead of turning the debate in to the failures of Marxism? As far as I’m aware there’s only one poster who would identify himself with being a Marxist. There was another, ‘99%’, but he’s not around. And Christianity has nothing to do with it either.

3 users thanked author for this post.

Heath, Iron-awe,

[Iron-awe]

billpuntonsghost wrote:

Iron awe – evidence?
If you read my posts you would say “Christian”.
If you read the main posters on here you would say “Marxists.”

That’s not evidence bill and you well know it, come on think harder.

[Anonymous]

Marxism has indeed inspired communists who have used it to kill and oppress. Communism is an ideology which must be opposed in all law abiding states for its tendency for tyranny and misery. Quite how this makes Christianity preferable is beyond me.

Christian literalism, which BPG endorses, saw us live by superstition with the heathens and witches being killed. A higher percentage of Jews died in the Crusades, by the hands of Christians, than during the Holocaust (noted, the population was smaller, so killing a larger proportion was easier, so this doesn’t take away from the Holocaust’s unique horror. Though, it still shows the sheer hatred for Jews by the Christians). It was the enlightenment and increased secularism which brought the scientific achievements which has allowed us to reduce disease and increase life spans, alongside the technological achievements which has seen society progress to higher living standards.

Many of those who played a role here would have been religious, so I am not knocking religious belief. However, it was the more liberally minded who tended to help progress. It wasn’t because of religious literalism. If we had lived by the Bible we would without the scientific progress we have made, because the almighty church would have deemed the scientific progress blasphemy. It was only because of the secularists, which does include Christians, as to why we have been able to reduce death. Sure, some would say that the Christian nature of the secularists may count for something, but let’s be honest, BPG’s brand of Christianity isn’t that. It’s far more traditional and dogmatic. The part of Christianity which hindered, not helped conditions.

The only possible alternative to religion isn’t Marxism. There are plenty of secular worldviews possible which don’t hold misery. The UK is a lot more secular now than it was and it’s far more preferable to live in with longer life spans, reduced conflict and disease, and not once have we been Marxist.

I agree with others too. There isn’t an abundance of Marxists here. There is only one self-avowed Marxist. Those who cry Marxism like this only show their sheer ignorance of what Marxism is. It doesn’t involve a belief in market based economies, which most adhere to, even the social democrats and the Labour Party as a whole. Joe Biden and Barack Obama both promote such, but get derided as Marxists by those who don’t have a clue.

And what has kneeling got to do with it? It was started by NFL players highlighting racial injustice. Being for a more liberal standpoint doesn’t make you a Marxist.

[j charles]

Here we go again deerey and iron telling people how they should think and behave, nothing but a pair of vile bigots who never accept that other people could have opinions that differ from theirs.

[Deereyme66]

Aw, upset the racists were drowned out are we? Quite happy to accept others opinions and frequently do. Not from a bunch of nonsensical racists though thanks. You’ve not lost the argument though because you never presented a coherent one in the first place. Stop crying man!

[Deereyme66]

And your ilk have the temerity to call me a snowflake? Jokers.

[j charles]

Deereyme66 wrote:

Aw, upset the racists were drowned out are we? Quite happy to accept others opinions and frequently do. Not from a bunch of nonsensical racists though thanks. You’ve not lost the argument though because you never presented a coherent one in the first place. Stop crying man!

Deerey, I have never presented an argument as I started by asking a reasonable question, however people like you took some form of dislike to it and continued to call me and some others on this forum racist. Well you know what nothing could be further from the truth and you have made a complete c–t of yourself. I have no further interest in what you have to say because you have not spoken the slightest bit sence throughout. Cant be bothered with bigots like you.

[Author]

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