Roe v Wade

[Siderite]

Interesting article on the subject, which touches on how state democracy. I find it a bit rich of Republicans to claim they’re standing for state democracy when they have done so much to damage state democracy.

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2022/08/15/state-legislatures-are-torching-democracy

[Iron-awe]

….or just democracy in general since the odious lying Trump appeared on the scene. America is in danger of becoming a future dictatorship unless the GOP get their fingers out and start concentrating on promoting policies instead of conspiracy theories. You need to have a good look at how some of the media in the USA operate to see how unbelievably bad the situation is becoming. Land of the free? Maybe not for too much longer if certain factions get in power and stay there.

1 user thanked author for this post.

Deereyme66

[Siderite]

One point made in there is that this position is still arguing the hypothetical. The way many states have been gerrymandered have overwhelmingly favoured Republicans to the detriment of the majority in that state. Also, that this predated Trump. The watering down of democracy has long been happening, certainly at state level.

[BobbyGmeister]

Good to get a win after so long without one!

[Siderite]

Are you talking about the game or Kansas, Bobby? X-)

[BobbyGmeister]

The game of course, how has non football crept in again?

[Siderite]

BobbyGmeister wrote:

The game of course, how has non football crept in again?

You were the one who posted this on a non-footy thread. :-P

1 user thanked author for this post.

BobbyGmeister

[Deereyme66]

BobbyGmeister wrote:

The game of course, how has non football crept in again?

I think Matt opened a catflap – not the whole door though 🙂

1 user thanked author for this post.

BobbyGmeister

[Iron-awe]

I see the FBI are busting Trump now, what a shame.

[Siderite]

Well, they have raided his house. We do not know what for; it could be to retrieve a document which he was refusing to hand over. As little as that. The hyperventilating from the right, who seem to expect the former president to be above the law, is nothing short of pitiful. Yet another example of the American right showing they do not care about things like democracy and the law.

1 user thanked author for this post.

Deereyme66

[Iron-awe]

Yes but more interesting for me is that it’s another first for a former president who is fighting legal cases on several fronts whilst still hosting rallies for his cult following and telling multiple lies live on the tv channels that still choose to broadcast them. All very interesting and for me another example of his narcissistic personality which appears to control his entire life, wonder where it will all end up for him?

1 user thanked author for this post.

Deereyme66

[Deereyme66]

Oh, I missed that. Not done much news today apart from Catalonian festivals and someone saying ‘scorchio’ on the weather bulletins. I hope that piece of s*** gets everything he deserves.

[Just Iron]

I don’t see it like you guys at all. And no .. I am not a redneck, or uneducated, or a fascist or unfamiliar with the US political scene. I think your take is wrong on this. I think this is purely political and driven by the hatred and fear that ‘the Donald’ has engendered in the Washington elite. If the same enthusiasm to investigate across the political spectrum had been consistently applied … if justice was indeed ‘blind’ … then Hunter Bidens laptop and all the implications for the whole family would not have been buried by the FBI over the last two years. Then there’s the deletion of Nancy’s e mails with no repercussions. The refusal to even acknowledge let alone investigate Roy Epps and his cronies for their part on Jan 6th. I could add to the list. Once we redefine democracy as that which supports our ideology then we are indeed on the road to totalitarianism. Once the justice system becomes politicised then no one can sleep easy. Once the Republicans hold the levers again I hope to God that they don’t take the same path but rather restore credibility to the DOJ and to the FBI and other law enforcers.

[Just Iron]

Typo … should be Ray Epps.

[Siderite]

Ah, yes. The Republican FBI head is secretly working for the Democrats in a fiendish plot to retrieve documents, as in any legal investigation. This is all conspiracy theory, and a worry. It shows how far the right have fallen on respect for the law and democracy. If their favoured candidate is involved in an investigation it has to be crooked, but waffle about Benghazi, Hunter Biden’s laptop (or some other spurious claim) has to be real. For some reason, those FBI heads, who are Republicans, are working with Democrats for some deep state power grab. Make it make sense

I am surprised you have fallen down this rabbit hole of tin foil hattedness, JI. I thought you were more reasonable than that. It will be paedophile rings from pizza restaurants next and Q’s plan to out them all.

3 users thanked author for this post.

Gurnelista, Iron-awe, Deereyme66

[Siderite]

There is one party which is against democratic norms in the USA, and it’s not the Democrats. One which couldn’t accept an election loss and made efforts to overturn. One which is currently gerrymandering for its own benefit. One which sees an investigation by the FBI as against democracy, based on unevidenced conspiracies about evil elites. Opposing this is not against democracy. Supporting those trying to tear down legal responsibility for actions, because they support those involved is. No-one is above the law in the USA.

1 user thanked author for this post.

Iron-awe

[Deereyme66]

Aye, totally unfounded claims there JI. But then, you believe in the existence of God so it’s hardly a surprise.

[Iron-awe]

The guy currently heading the FBI was appointed by Trump and you have not a shred of evidence to back up your claim that what is happening to Trump is just politically driven, if so then produce it. Nobody knows what the outcome of this search warrant executed at Trumps gaff will produce, if anything but the FBI will have had a very good reason to investigate based on information received. Don’t forget that Trump is fighting on several legal fronts right now based on fraud, attempting to get Georgia to overturn its election results personally ( that telephone call which if you have not heard is deffo worth a listen ) and his tax returns have finally been given the green light to be investigated after a massive legal fight by Trump to stop it. Just to remind you that Trump is the first president ever to not release his tax returns since they became the subject of public scrutiny many years ago. It’s all about transparency and when you are at the top you have to be seen to be that, plus if the guy has nothing to hide then what is the issue? Regarding Hunter Biden, who has never been president and never run the USA, I’m not sure of the point you are making JI, if the relevant authorities think he has commited a law breaking act and have evidence to pursue him on that evidence then they will act but he is a member of the public not a member of the USA goverment.

2 users thanked author for this post.

Deereyme66, Siderite

[Siderite]

As for Ray Epps, I am sure we should be launching widespread investigations because right wingers noticed him whispering in an ear. Investigations of those involved would be corrupt though.

[billpuntonsghost]

JI wants to speak from a neutral starting point, but you can’t “win” by argument .
The Bible explains this in Ephesians 2:2 and Romans 1:22.

[Deereyme66]

Groan….

[Deereyme66]

The bible also says ‘you reap what you sow’, which appears to be happening to Trump.

2 users thanked author for this post.

Gurnelista, BobbyGmeister

[Iron-awe]

Now Trump pleads the fifth amendment in the case of his business dealings in New York today as is his legal right. However the Donald has stated in the past that he doesn’t understand why people ” take the fifth ” they should just answer truthfully, could you make it up? Actually the Donald can but on this occasion declined, I wonder why. 😂

1 user thanked author for this post.

Deereyme66

[Deereyme66]

Did sweaty Rudy advise him so?

[Deereyme66]

Sorry, can’t resist

[Siderite]

Siderite wrote:

As for Ray Epps, I am sure we should be launching widespread investigations because right wingers noticed him whispering in an ear. Investigations of those involved would be corrupt though.
<iframe class=”wp-embedded-content” sandbox=”allow-scripts” security=”restricted” title=”New Evidence Undercuts Jan. 6 Instigator Conspiracy Theory” src=”https://www.nytimes.com/svc/oembed/html/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.nytimes.com%2F2022%2F05%2F05%2Fus%2Fjan-6-ray-epps-evidence.html#?secret=i9TtQPoMOR&#8221; data-secret=”i9TtQPoMOR” scrolling=”no” frameborder=”0″></iframe>

Proper link here: https://www.nytimes.com/2022/05/05/us/jan-6-ray-epps-evidence.html

[Siderite]

Iron-awe wrote:

Now Trump pleads the fifth amendment in the case of his business dealings in New York today as is his legal right. However the Donald has stated in the past that he doesn’t understand why people ” take the fifth ” they should just answer truthfully, could you make it up? Actually the Donald can but on this occasion declined, I wonder why.

It’s because the deep state elite have got to him! ;-)

[Just Iron]

Happy to have made a contribution guys. No hyperventilating here and as reasonable as ever. I found your collective responses pretty well as predictable as I anticipated .. except the level of insult was far milder than expected so that’s some thing. I am rigorous in trying not to be politically partisan … and sincerely trying is all anyone can do .. but I am not confident that any of you could put hand on heart and say the same.
A word to you Bill since you now seem determined to pursue this ‘theological sniping’. If it’s such a waste of time entering into discourse with ‘the unredeemed’ then why do you come on Bru at all? Surely your time will be better spent exchanging ideas with ‘the elect.’

[Siderite]

You say that, JI, but Gurny hasn’t yet graced us with his opinion! :-)

I disagree with your opinions, but I try my very best to separate belief from the person. I can respect the person without necessarily respecting the opinion. If that makes sense.

Though, I am sceptical of your claimed political neutrality given your response, which appears very partisan. Such conspiracies are not common outside of Trump fanatics.

I would say the same thing. I am appearing from a neutral standpoint, to some degree. I can criticise the Democrats, for example, and there is much to criticise, from the ‘Squad’ to their mistaken views on trans rights. However, an investigation into Trump for wrongdoing isn’t that. If a Trump appointed FBI lead, who considers himself to be Republican, launching this is deemed ‘political’ I don’t think you’d consider any action to retrieve documents as part of an investigation to be non-political, and it’s based on nothing but your own beliefs about elites. This speaks more of your own political bias, not mine.

2 users thanked author for this post.

Deereyme66, Iron-awe

[Deereyme66]

‘I am rigorous in trying not to be politically partisan … and sincerely trying is all anyone can do .. but I am not confident that any of you could put hand on heart and say the same.’

Oh dear

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