Iron Bru › Forums › Non Football › Inept Government
- This topic has 154 replies, 14 voices, and was last updated 2 years, 2 months ago by Deereyme66.
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September 28, 2022 at 5:04 pm #245700
‘Tell the IMF to take a running jump’
Absolute madness. So, any institution that doesn’t agree with the crazy attitude of the Tories needs to do one? It’s that isolationalist attitude and approach to national and international relations that have got the country in such a mess, not you and your mates never ending stream of nonsense and your policies designed to protect and better the few. ‘Let’s be clear’ doesn’t validate anything you claim btw.
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September 28, 2022 at 5:11 pm #245701You might want to take a look at where Swanny’s attitude to those who aren’t interested on taking ‘my way or the highway’ has got him and the institution he’s supposed to be a good custodian of, contrast and compare to how your Party are running the country off a cliff edge. It’s not rocket science and thankfully the population are coming to their senses. Change is in the air. I think you know that already but fair play for flogging a dead horse in the face of reality.
September 28, 2022 at 5:34 pm #245705Actually, I didn’t say that anyone had insulted me, so at very least get your facts straight. I simply pointed out the complete lack of constructive argument and insults, which are there in black and white.
Siderite, net-zero is exactly why we’re in the economic position we are now; and it’s the same for pretty much all countries in the Western world. The cost of energy surged because the wind stopped blowing and the sun stopped shining, which wouldn’t have been a problem if governments had continued to support fossil-fuels. But, of course, those who “know best” — including many on here and mainly on the left — have been lobbying to stop the use of fossil-fuels, despite anyone who can do basic arithmetic telling them this would lead to big problems. Many of us have also been warning that Germany and others were heading for trouble if they continued to rely on gas supplied by a despot.
These are the plain and simple facts. Another plain and simple fact is that whatever the Government had done in the current circumstances was going to upset someone. These are very difficult times, which call for very difficult measures. The worst thing that Truss and Kwarteng could have done was “play it safe”, which might have been politically expedient but of little help to the country.
What we’re seeing is the markets completely over-reacting. The BoE is there to do what’s necessary to address this reaction. Truss and Kwarteng need to stand firm regardless of all the inevitable stuff being hurled at them. Of course they’re taking a risk, but doing too little or nothing would have been worse.
September 28, 2022 at 5:35 pm #245706Whoosh. I can’t be arsed engaging with any debate if you miss the point entirely.
September 28, 2022 at 5:39 pm #245707“Actually, I didn’t say that anyone had insulted me,”
Literally the post before on this thread by you:
“No constructive argument, just insults.”
Also, doing nothing wouldn’t have caused a crash which has jeopardised mortgages and pensions. Not only that, made fuel costs worse. Other countries somehow managed not to short their currency and damage the economy with actions to mitigate the cost of living crisis.
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September 28, 2022 at 5:53 pm #245713Yet another Bucksiron climate change thread in disguise!
September 28, 2022 at 6:00 pm #245714‘Actually, I didn’t say that anyone had insulted me, so at very least get your facts straight. I simply pointed out the complete lack of constructive argument and insults, which are there in black and white.’
Just fact checked. We’re all good thanks. 👍
Though I’m not sure from that quote if you claim there were insults or not? Seems contradictory. Anyhow, always the case with you Bucks, pointless getting in to a constructive debate with you. You’ll no doubt resort to straw manning and gaslighting at some point. You forget, some of us are past masters of playing that game with you. Anyhow, been good to hear from you.
September 28, 2022 at 6:32 pm #245717I’d love to know where the insults are in this thread. IA calling Truss St Liz, me sarcastically calling Lilico and Hannan geniuses?
That’s tame and the sort of thing most engage in. Maybe I should be woke and politically correct in future and not gently tease anyone who I think have made daft arguments. There are hardly death threats, grievous insults (like c**t) being used. I have seen Bucks language of a similar kind before, but it’s ok when he does it.
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September 28, 2022 at 7:24 pm #245719As for the great experts points about Biden, well be has created 10 million jobs since being elected and like any other nation the USA is finding inflation a real challenge but are not employing trickle down economics to address their problems like us because they know long term it flops. Reagan tried it in his time as President and had moderate success initially but it eventually tanked, jobs went again and it added $2.3 trillion dollars to the USA national debt. Not bad for a politician who believes in free markets and making profits, as for Biden’s approval rate most polls put him at about 41%, not huge but about right for a mid term President. When Trump left office his approval rating was 29%, just to keep Buck’s in the picture. Don’t believe everything you hear on Fox News Buck’s, there’s a good lad.
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September 28, 2022 at 8:00 pm #245720Someone has taken a picture of Bucksiron mulling over his responses:
*This is meant to be a bit of tongue in cheek banter, not an attempt at bullying or insulting. We all have to laugh at ourselves. There’s plenty to laugh about me, after all.
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September 28, 2022 at 8:11 pm #245721Certainly not bullying or insulting. Most people without an ulterior motive (i.e. tax interests) and a modicum of politics and economics knowledge, can see what’s going on
September 29, 2022 at 8:20 am #245736Simon Hoare, the Tory MP for North Dorset, tweeted: “In the words of Norman Lamont on Black Wednesday: ‘Today has been a very difficult day’. These are not circumstances beyond the control of govt/Treasury. They were authored there. This inept madness cannot go on.”
‘Inept madness’. We’re saying the same words on here as the Tories are saying about themselves. What an utter shambles. Makes Swanny look competent ffs.
September 29, 2022 at 12:13 pm #245768Anyone who believes Biden is doing a good job just has to look at his approval ratings. They’ve recovered a bit recently but are still woeful and reflect the damage he’s done to the cost-of-living in the States. What’s saved the USA from even worse problems is the fact they’re not reliant on imported energy, although Biden’s doing his best to destroy that as well.
Regarding the UK, I completely agree it’s a shambles. But is anyone on here prepared to admit why? The two biggest reasons by a long way are energy costs and post-pandemic supply problems. Of course, the usual suspects will no doubt blame Putin and Brexit, both of which will have played a part but Putin simply took advantage of a situation created by daft net-zero targets while the opportunities offered by Brexit are yet to be fully realised.
I’m not supporting the Tories in any of this. Boris screwed up massively with far too much emphasis on renewables, which though desirable in the long-term are nowhere near ready to replace our energy needs, while he should have come out of lockdowns far sooner. Yet again the so-called ‘experts’, in this case health scientists and computer modellers, have been proved to be totally and utterly wrong. The key point here is that all of these things were fully supported by Labour and Starmer even wanted to extend the lockdowns.
Getting back to the mini-budget, there’s no doubt it was poorly managed but what Truss and Kwarteng are doing is fundamentally right. The idea that markets reacted badly because taxes for higher earners were reduced makes absolutely no sense because the amounts involved are small. What the markets have been unhappy about is the use of debt to fund the growth and the government’s commitment to support consumers on energy costs, which have been conveniently ignored by many commentators. There’s also no question that markets will have exploited the situation by shorting the pound.
As I’ve said before and will repeat, Truss and Kwarteng need to stand firm. Of course they need to do more to bring the markets onside and it would also help if the BoE had been more aggressive in raising interest rates higher and sooner. At least the Bank stepped in yesterday and it might have to do so again as it’s going to be a bumpy ride. Of course this will affect people with mortgages, but interest rates are still far, far lower than they were not that long ago; and, again as I’ve said before this will help savers who have had no support for far too long.
Finally, Labour needs to be careful what it wishes for. The world’s in a difficult place at the moment and the idea that Starmer could wave a magic wand is fanciful to say the least.
September 29, 2022 at 12:22 pm #245770Hallo hallo anybody in, earth calling Buck’s wake up and smell the coffee, come out of the darkness and read posts based on facts.
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September 29, 2022 at 12:40 pm #245772Bucks battling against reality and acting like the this is fine meme. Suits me, if the Tories delude themselves along his thinking they’re not going to improve in ratings.
10 years ago we needed to reduce the deficit, reduce borrowing because we spent too much, so the poor need to have services cut back. Now we need to borrow to fund tax cuts for the rich. It’s transparent.
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September 29, 2022 at 12:48 pm #245773Hallo hallo anybody in, earth calling Buck’s wake up and smell the coffee, come out of the darkness and read posts based on facts.
Partisan Tories are really grasping at straws to pretend this is normal. If it wasn’t for the fact many will now suffer because of their ideology I would be pleased, as it is electoral suicide.
One thing party supporters should bear in mind is that it’s never good when the opposite side rub their hands with glee. Tories understandably did it with Corbyn, now Tories should think why Labour are getting more optimistic with Truss. The more they delude themselves and double down, the more gleeful hands will be rubbed.
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September 29, 2022 at 1:27 pm #245778Double down double dozy Liz doing the local radio rounds – yet another bizarre escapade and performance
September 29, 2022 at 4:30 pm #245800A couple of questions after Bucksirons article. Please define post pandemic supply problems. This seems to be the present government’s get out of jail card when questioned. I suspect it means a shortage of critical workers from outside the UK but brexiteers won’t accept that. Also energy support has happened across Europe with no great issues on the financial markets. A disdain for climate change issues, however painful the present consequences may be, do not reflect well on the life chances of future generations.
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September 29, 2022 at 4:46 pm #245802Bucks doesn’t accept that there will be any meaningful consequences of climate change, so he’ll just shrug his shoulders at that.
September 29, 2022 at 5:33 pm #245804Huckleberry:
“Post pandemic supply problems”: obviously Brexit’s had an impact but this is a global issue. It’s one reason why inflation is high everywhere, or are you not aware of that?
“Energy support has happened across Europe with no great issues on the financial markets”: that is incorrect. The euro’s dropped a lot over the past 12 months against the dollar
I suggest you check your facts. Interesting to see the pound’s risen today
September 29, 2022 at 5:43 pm #245805Of course it has after BoE stabilisation. If you’re pinning your economic hopes on emergency intervention to bail us out as economic policy, I would be concerned.
September 29, 2022 at 6:09 pm #245806You’re very good at telling your detractors to check their facts Bucks. Thing is, when we do, we mostly find you’ve got it completely wrong. Unless you’re basing much òf your supposed facts on opions of Telegraph / Spectator journalists and climate change deniers like that loop the loop Phin poster who haunted these shores for a brief period some years ago? Yes, the pound has risen today. You’re surely not implying it has anything to do with confidence in your leaders and little to do with the bailout are you?
September 29, 2022 at 6:37 pm #245807Brexit has been an issue is somewhat understating the problem. I agree the Euro has fallen in value but the European Central Bank didn’t need to intervene to support European markets. I still await your definition of post pandemic supply chain issues. Maybe you should ask the prime minister or chancellor as they use this excuse at every opportunity.
September 30, 2022 at 9:13 am #245817“Anyone who believes Biden is doing a good job just has to look at his approval ratings”.
Anyone who thinks Truss is doing a good job, or as you say, should stand firm, just has to look at the approval ratings.
Labour 54%, Tories 21%.
Agent Truss is just doing fine!!
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September 30, 2022 at 9:16 am #245819“Many of us have also been warning that Germany and others were heading for trouble if they continued to rely on gas supplied by a despot”.
Us??? Such pomposity. Wasn’t aware that German leaders were keen readers of the forum.
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September 30, 2022 at 9:48 am #245820Also, I would say there is more to deciphering whether a leader is doing a good job than approval ratings. For example, the 30% of ardent Trump fans are hardly going to say Biden is doing a good job, from a place of reasoned argument, no matter what.
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September 30, 2022 at 9:54 am #245821“Many of us have also been warning that Germany and others were heading for trouble if they continued to rely on gas supplied by a despot”.
Us??? Such pomposity. Wasn’t aware that German leaders were keen readers of the forum.
Also, those who are disagreeing with Bucks don’t unanimously think everything others have done has been great. Germany’s decision to cut back on nuclear has been disastrous.
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September 30, 2022 at 2:43 pm #245833Truss and her backers have clearly been sent scripts to talk about the measures to deal with the energy crisis, but to completely ignore any questions about the shitshow of tax cuts for the rich and the disaster it caused to the market and mortgages. Bucks has clearly read the memo.
Truss was absolutely useless in the round of radio interviews. She failed to answer questions on how they would assess local support for fracking. Might be because there won’t be any support.
She then repeatedly said that energy bills would be capped at a maximum of £2500. They won’t and some pensioners already believe they can have their heating on full blast because bills will be capped.
She couldn’t even give a straight answer about a needed hospital upgrade close to her constituency.
Dim witted, robotic speaking, and doesn’t know the details of her own policies.
The Tories have chosen well. Surprised if she survives much longer after the conference. Can’t wait for her “rousing” speech.
September 30, 2022 at 2:55 pm #245834Aye, get the popcorn ready for conference footage! Will she forget the script and start wanging on about pork and cheese again?! Probably not far off this parody…
October 1, 2022 at 11:29 am #245845I do wish the usual suspects would actually read my comments. What I actually wrote was: “there’s no doubt it [the mini-budget] was poorly managed but what Truss and Kwarteng are doing is fundamentally right.” It was very poorly managed but that doesn’t mean the strategy is wrong.
Let’s also look at a few other facts:
1. The UK is NOT in recession. The BoE was wrong
2. The pound has strengthened a lot, not least because the markets over-reacted and can see the UK economy is in far better shape than claimed by the left-wing commentators falling over themselves to knock the Tories.
3. The Government has stepped in to reduce the impact of crazy energy prices driven by an absurd net-zero policy
4. The reason the BoE had to step in to ‘save’ the pension funds was largely down to the funds using LDIs (Liability Driven Investments). The irony here is that LDIs are being used largely because interest rates have been so low that the funds have taken to using higher risk strategies to cover final salary schemes, which the BoE should never have allowed to happen in the first place.As for energy prices, the reason we’re in this entire mess is down to the stupid drive to net-zero, using renewables that can’t cope with our energy needs and failing to support fossil fuels, which will be needed for many decades to come. The Government’s doing what it can to support consumers though the reason pensioners and others are being forced into this ridiculous situation is down to all politicians across all parties backing the net-zero fiasco.
And yes, many people, including me, HAVE been warning for years that what has happened would happen if Germany and others didn’t stop relying on gas from a dictator every bit as bad as Hitler. Many on here just listen to the so-called ‘experts’ and believe everything these people say, from economics to climate change and lockdowns, without ever questioning them.
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