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It’s a clear choice.
We either pontificate and try to make DH so uncomfortable that he walks away – with the concomitant 95% (???) probability that the club folds
OR
We make the best of a bad job; learn to control our ‘oh-so justifiable moral outrage’ and perhaps give the man space to breathe. After all that has been stated in anger – we now need calmness. Oodles of it!
Let us, at least, make it possible for him to stay.
The one thing that may well separate him from the previous owners appears to be that he seemingly cares whether our club survives or not.
When our very survival hangs in the balance – I rather wish that some on here would learn to look at the big picture FIRST!If Hilton can’t handle comments on a messageboard that aren’t supportive, deary me. My experience is that companies fail because of fragile egos at the top who cannot handle dissenting opinion, which often leads to poor decision making and poor staff happiness and support. The fact is that Hilton lied to us, saying that he hasn’t used other names besides Hilton and White, hasn’t been to prison, said that fraud claims were nonsense and launched accusations against anyone for suspecting he had. Even those, like the owners of this site, who hadn’t even got involved with these accusations.
After all this, we’re supposed to just accept it and believe anything he says, or we’re at fault? Nope, doesn’t work that way, I’m afraid. He’s had the backing of many, still does, but has been found to be dishonest about an incredibly serious issue after stoking division against those who had concerns. I was concerned before, and that wasn’t good enough, and now some of the concerns have come true it is still not good enough, apparently. Nothing will be good enough, seemingly, other than clapping and giving moral support to someone I do not think is fit to run a football club given his shadiness, aversion to honest disclosure (until he can no longer refute) and still more concerns around (not paying players, for example).
I have discussed the perilous nature of our position and have said multiple times that I realise it’s not a case of him cutting dry for our sakes. However, ideally he finds someone and sells up to someone more befitting, so him and his circus can clear off and we don’t have the mess which seemingly travels wherever he goes. Of course, he can prove me wrong, but after months of nonsense from his mouth I think I am entitled to be outright sceptical of the guy. He controls this football club, not me or others pontificating away on a football messageboard. Any negative fallout from his decisions will be on him.
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Topics: 67he seemingly cares whether our club survives or not.
Why is that?
He’s no affinity to the club.
He’s not a supporter.
What’s the plan? It has never been revealed.1 user thanked author for this post.
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Topics: 67There is more spotlight on Scunthorpe ,than Ilkeston – an established league club v (no disrespect to them ) one that would not get as much scrutiny both from the press and fans alike .
It’s astounding he thought his past would not come out , surely if he had honest intentions the best thing would have been to be truthful from the start .
The proceeding 9 months just makes you question ‘can a leopard really change it’s spots?’ at least from anyone with either a neutral or balanced perspective.
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‘We make the best of a bad job; learn to control our ‘oh-so justifiable moral outrage’ and perhaps give the man space to breathe. After all that has been stated in anger – we now need calmness. Oodles of it!’
Sorry Les, that’s a load of old tut IMO. It’s not simply about moral outrage is it. There are serious ramifications still to be dealt with in the Athletic article that the FA and other authorities are probably investigating. If there’s any more wrong doings he only has his self to blame if he’s punished for them. Whatever he’s done for the club so far can’t deny the law. You of all people should know that being a magistrate or ex. I suspect there’s more revelations to come and I’m concerned about a lot of the things he’s previously said about what he’s doing at the club and the actual state of affairs down at GP. Because I hear from reliable sources they are worse than before he took over.
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It’s a clear choice.
We either pontificate and try to make DH so uncomfortable that he walks away – with the concomitant 95% (???) probability that the club folds
OR
We make the best of a bad job; learn to control our ‘oh-so justifiable moral outrage’ and perhaps give the man space to breathe. After all that has been stated in anger – we now need calmness. Oodles of it!
Let us, at least, make it possible for him to stay.
The one thing that may well separate him from the previous owners appears to be that he seemingly cares whether our club survives or not.
When our very survival hangs in the balance – I rather wish that some on here would learn to look at the big picture FIRST!I would have expected better from you Les than this reductive simplistic summation. How do we even know we have been “saved” at the moment?
The ground has not been purchased. Taft is citing unpaid wages. CCJs. Is there more fire under that smoke?
There’s far more valid reasons for concern than “moral outrage” although, for what it’s worth, I think holding the custodians of our club to a high moral standard is no bad thing.
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The problem now is that after not being truthful about the prison/fraudulent past claim, with these being dismissed as rumours by trouble makers, it removes any credibility when he denies any other rumour. Of course, that doesn’t make those rumours true, but it means they’re going to be less easily dismissed.
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I am still trying to get my head around the “Feck off you criminal but keep paying (at least some) of the bills until you find a nice new owner for us that will pay Swann twice the value for his land” message.
I understand that some people find the deception unforgivable – not happy about it myself but my default is to give people a chance when they have made a mistake. I struggle personally with the low tolerance to someone making a mistake having made a few myself but fully respect that people have to be true to their own belief system and moral code.
But if you want him gone then surely you want him gone right now. Why on earth would he/should he keep paying the bills and take responsibility to find an “acceptable” new owner?
There’s a false narrative being spun that he is now being hounded out by supporters.
I’ve seen few messages actually openly wanted him to leave. Apart the Facebook cult group, most supporters seem not only concerned with the revelations in the athletic, but the manner in which they were hidden after honesty and transparency were promised.
In all honesty, I’d wager most of us would put that to one side if the football club was set on a path where our future was secured. However, we now have ex players coming out demanding wages- and from what the ‘rumours’ are suggesting, the same rumours which nearly all being proven to be correct unfortunately, things are only going to get worse.
My hope was that in his interview he would double down on his commitment to SUFC. A small part of me still does but that is more in hope than expectation.
For anyone to suggest this is in anyway the blame of supporters, needs to sit back, take emotion out of this and objectively look at what is unfolding in front of us.
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Topics: 67I am still trying to get my head around the “Feck off you criminal but keep paying (at least some) of the bills until you find a nice new owner for us that will pay Swann twice the value for his land” message.
I understand that some people find the deception unforgivable – not happy about it myself but my default is to give people a chance when they have made a mistake. I struggle personally with the low tolerance to someone making a mistake having made a few myself but fully respect that people have to be true to their own belief system and moral code.
But if you want him gone then surely you want him gone right now. Why on earth would he/should he keep paying the bills and take responsibility to find an “acceptable” new owner?
I think most people realise, even if they don’t like him, that if he was to cut and leave immediately, without a buyer, we’re in big trouble. If anyone was calling for him to go like that, we’d get accusations of wanting the club dead (as there are anyway).
As for mistakes, his mistake in the past was rather deliberate, not an accident. We should get second chances, but what has he done since coming here? Lie, accuse others of being trouble makers out to get him. I think those who were concerned are going to react angrily when it turns out their concerns had validity after being told how bad we are for having concerns or for raising them. He hasn’t apologised for this, nor for his indiscretions, which were coupled with self-sorrow. Even then, he couldn’t resist in blaming others for daring to bring it to light. Chances are that we’d never get this admission by Hilton, unless someone like The Athletic journalists brought it to the forefront. I’d be more accepting of mistakes if he had been honest, and far sooner, apologised for his actions (and not just the fraud) and we didn’t have concerns about CCJs, unpaid wages etc over our heads.
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Topics: 67The sole issue here is the survival of our beloved Iron.
If the chairman has a chance to achieve this – assuming he still wants to make the effort – I do not see how we can fail to support him.
“But Les, what if it’s only a 20% chance?” – I’d snap his hands off!For me to feel differently, I’d need to know that Elliott/Sharpe (or others ???) have the wherewithal to save the club.
Phoenix club? – If even possible – that could take a great deal more years than I and many other folks on this board have left to us.All this “but whole will fund Scunthorpe United if David White-Hilton-Anderson-Mellors pulls out” are presupposing that he has the funds to continue his funding if he stays. With all the issues around non-payment of wages / pensions, the mounting list of CCJs, and the lack of transparency around the source of his funds, I am left feeling that he doesn’t have a pot to p1$$ in and we are already doomed.
I hope I am proven wrong, but I suspect that unless something changes rapidly, regardless of whether David White-Hilton-Anderson-Mellors is at the helm, the club may not see the end of this season.
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Knew not buying a season ticket was the right thing to do then SODIron.
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Topics: 67The sole issue here is the survival of our beloved Iron.
If the chairman has a chance to achieve this – assuming he still wants to make the effort – I do not see how we can fail to support him.
“But Les, what if it’s only a 20% chance?” – I’d snap his hands off!For me to feel differently, I’d need to know that Elliott/Sharpe (or others ???) have the wherewithal to save the club.
Phoenix club? – If even possible – that could take a great deal more years than I and many other folks on this board have left to us.Fail to support him? You have no idea about Hilton or his financial position. Likewise, you have absolutely no idea regarding the current financial position of the club. Public records and social media posts by third parties indicate that things are far from healthy.
With all due respect, you’re gambling on an individual just because he’s insitu, there is no other credible reason for your support.
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I said yesterday, I’d prefer he stayed rather than cut loose. That would appease those who don’t want him to leave and leave him more open to ongoing scrutiny by the authorities and not potentially disappearing.
An interesting point. MK Iron puts the statement of getting round how people who don’t like him and wished we had someone else as owner can’t just want him out immediately. I realise it’s a tricky situation. However, I cannot understand how others expect those of us who are sceptical or disliking of his ownership can support him. I find him utterly unfit to run this club after his dishonesty, accusations against others which are quite slanderous to say the least and amounting suspicion that he can’t fund the club.
For those with similar opinions, what are we supposed to do? Does anyone think it’s reasonable to swallow doubt over very serious worries and support someone they do not trust? If our success is dependent on every fan swallowing worries and not airing their mind, in case it hounds him out, it isn’t workable. Les and MKiron make good points in what happens without him, but I do not think he has the money anyway and I find it hard to back someone I distrust so much in owning the club. Just as many did with Swann, despite opposition and the same claims hurled at them (and they turned out to be correct).
One possible solution would be to grin and bear it, hoping he does the best, but remaining very wary. I don’t see how this week’s revealings can lead to anything but increased wariness, given the nature of it all. People have said that he deserves second chances and such, sure, but this comes after dishonesty and a serious crime related to scamming people of money. Of course he could have rehabilitated, but how can we be sure? I would say this would demand vigilance. Yet such suggestions and concerns get accusations that you want the club dead and picking on poor Dave, who has regrets. I am admittedly bamboozled at how we are expected to throw caution to the wind and support him given the context and circumstances. Some have taken it to absurd levels.
I don’t want to appear harsh. People with depression deserve sympathy and people deserve second chances. However, I don’t like the idea of depression being a prevention from criticism and it doesn’t protect from people disliking your actions and words. Second chances should be possible, but people who have done serious wrong should realise that greater scrutiny may be there, because we only have their word that it won’t happen again. Current issues around wages and pensions indicate that he may not be the most responsible or able to pay for his obligations.
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Good post Siderite.
I agree with you probably more than you think. I did write a post early on after I heard David Hilton’s Sound cloud interview/statement/emotional outpouring in which I offered him the advice to issue an apology for misleading fans and to pay any outstanding invoices.
My opinion only but I think he deserves a second chance over the Fraud conviction but appreciate other don’t. I assume people that feel this way would want him away from the club immediately.
The apology and payment of outstanding debts would at least help take a bit of heat out of the situation.
None of this makes me a Hilton “supporter”. I didn’t support Swann or the Wharton’s either. I support the club and always will whoever (and sometimes in spite of) whoever is the chairman of the club.
The facts of the situation is that as ever is the case us supporters of a football club have little or no influence over control of said club.
Hilton has achieved a turnaround on the field at a club in seemingly terminal decline for 5 or 6 years. I give him credit for that. He is taking longer than I would like to solve the off field shitshow that he inherited. I have cut him slack on that due to the sheer scale of the inherited issues but after 6 months remaining issues should be sorted by now.
Regarding the ground and land I am hopeful that Hilton is working through a strategy to get that for something closer to its real market value. If that pisses off the previous owner I would see that as a bonus.
Sadly the only definite action we can ever take when disagreeing with the ownership is to stop going to games which is what half the fan base had done with the previous owner.
Good post Siderite.
I agree with you probably more than you think. I did write a post early on after I heard David Hilton’s Sound cloud interview/statement/emotional outpouring in which I offered him the advice to issue an apology for misleading fans and to pay any outstanding invoices.
My opinion only but I think he deserves a second chance over the Fraud conviction but appreciate other don’t. I assume people that feel this way would want him away from the club immediately.
The apology and payment of outstanding debts would at least help take a bit of heat out of the situation.
None of this makes me a Hilton “supporter”. I didn’t support Swann or the Wharton’s either. I support the club and always will whoever (and sometimes in spite of) whoever is the chairman of the club.
The facts of the situation is that as ever is the case us supporters of a football club have little or no influence over control of said club.
Hilton has achieved a turnaround on the field at a club in seemingly terminal decline for 5 or 6 years. I give him credit for that. He is taking longer than I would like to solve the off field shitshow that he inherited. I have cut him slack on that due to the sheer scale of the inherited issues but after 6 months remaining issues should be sorted by now.
Regarding the ground and land I am hopeful that Hilton is working through a strategy to get that for something closer to its real market value. If that pisses off the previous owner I would see that as a bonus.
Sadly the only definite action we can ever take when disagreeing with the ownership is to stop going to games which is what half the fan base had done with the previous owner.
I think that you have misunderstood about having a second chance. Nobody has, as far as I’ve seen, opposed DH because he went to prison for fraud, although it cannot be forgotten. What many have said is that he went out of his way to attack people who suggested that he had gone to prison and had other names than White & Hilton. He denied this vociferously and has only confirmed it after the Athletic published their research.
Additionally, he has never said sorry for what he did, not has he apologized to any of those who suggested that he had other names and had indeed been to prison.
He is still playing the victim by suggesting that people are affecting his mental health and by threatening to walk away.
Finally, it would appear that by changing his name to Anderson and being registered as a Director (for 8 different companies I believe) within 5 years of being struck off as a Director, he may have committed further frauds. Did he admit all this when he declared for the fit & proper test? Companies House certainly didn’t know about it, and I would be surprised if the FA did.
Personally, if DH were to apologise to all those he slagged off, showed some contrition for what he had done, and sorted out all the outstanding debts, then I would happily give him a second chance.
Sadly, I don’t believe that he will do any such thing.
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